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Jan 20, 2004 4:21:28 GMT -5
Post by Shelob on Jan 20, 2004 4:21:28 GMT -5
Aye, but I'm positive that will be the case. Both DaoC and WoW have those options, and I'd bet anything Everquest has something similar as well. One thing about Guilds on MMORPG's is to distinguish themselves from the other people on the server. The developers have seen the need for players to do so, so they enabled different guild attirement to be chosen in a wide variety of choices.
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Jan 21, 2004 16:26:58 GMT -5
Post by Alatar on Jan 21, 2004 16:26:58 GMT -5
The recognition of the player vs. the character is the key distinction between a normal and a roleplaying server, in my opinion. Since Valar in MEO will be playing on a normal server, it is entirely up to us how things will be regarded.
In D2X/LoD, I was Alatar regardless of which character class I was playing. In DAoC, I am only Alatar if the character is named thus. In fact, to sort of bridge this, my family mythos is "everyone pledged to the House of Alatar will choose a new name, incorporating the family name into it." Thus I have Alatarv, Alatarch, Alatarsong, Alatarward, etc., etc.
And yet, I found that I rather enjoyed giving each character a unique personality. The common naming made it simple for friends outside of the guild to recognize me, so I kept it, but I REALLY enjoyed being able to choose which character to play based on my mood.
Just my $.02 worth, again. ;D
- Al
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Varda
Vala, Council
Posts: 1,042
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Jan 21, 2004 18:38:02 GMT -5
Post by Varda on Jan 21, 2004 18:38:02 GMT -5
Sounds like fun, o House of Alatar! : )
We might additionally be able to use a particular last name for part of our "House". In EverQuest, we can add a second name after a little leveling.
I'll probably have to share the account with too many real life family members to make many characters, luckily for you guys.
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Eonwë
Vala, Council
Vala and proud member of the Valar Guild. A quarter century of Tolkien fun.
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Jan 27, 2004 0:37:51 GMT -5
Post by Eonwë on Jan 27, 2004 0:37:51 GMT -5
In MEO, the Last name is reportedly going to be the Kinship (guild) name, therefore Fainan Valar or Auros Valar, just like now where you are Varda Valar and I am Eonwe Valar, and Alatar is Alatar Valar and,.. well you get the point :}
Take care Eonwë
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Jan 28, 2004 17:04:28 GMT -5
Post by arathorn on Jan 28, 2004 17:04:28 GMT -5
Woof! Finally caught up on all my reading on the message board since getting my PC running again. OK, my ramblings now! ;D Leader: well everyone's agreed on that, only makes sense. Elders: hmm.. I'm getting a tad foggy here (shouldn't check the board while in the steam-room <sigh> ) .. I agree it should be Valar and Maiar, but there was some mention (by Varda, I believe) that possibly members that contribute more to the Guild (meetings, web pages, etc.) could be part of this group too? If that is the case, perhaps Elders (and even Members) can have different levels too, signified by special colour armour, insignia or medal (whatever may be possible in MEO). 1-Valar, 2-Maiar, then 3-different 'higher-members' all have 'indicators' ..umm.. only thing I'm not sure about is HOW that applies to the game. Just because I'm a more active member, what if a less active one achieves a higher rank in the game itself? How would that work? OR would the designations only be for the purpose of identifying the Guild 'rank' and not the game level rank? Members: Again, certain indicators for rank (still to be explained to l'il ole me ) Pledges: I agree that they should be given some incentive to want to join, maybe even have levels of pledges... hmmm. As for meetings, I'm inclined to agree with Eonwe. We have had 'visitors' in our Bnet meetings ever since I joined last May, so I see no reason for them to be left out now. I imagine the meeting you're talking about would be a new specific "MEO" meeting. My suggestion, since we seem to have moved to using AIM and so many people have it, would be to create a new meeting room there, which I think you all have already menatally ticked off , but also we could have a special 'pledge' room which would not be an official 'meeting' room, BUT anyone who wants to see if someone else is chatting about MEO can check out the room to see who's around, not unlike our special channels in Bnet. OR just leave the regular MEO room for that purpose outside of meeting days. Guess there's no real way to keep people out of a room in AIM like you can in Bnet. Depends which you think is better, and less confusing. Personally I've just confused myself, so... <wanders off..> SO, I'll have to 'one up' you there, Alatar, and toss in my *3* cents <clink, clink, BOINK!> ... ooops! .. sorry, that last one was a button ... <clink>... there.
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Varda
Vala, Council
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Jul 27, 2004 23:45:55 GMT -5
Post by Varda on Jul 27, 2004 23:45:55 GMT -5
Perhaps it would be easiest to identify a ranking character if the rank is only on his/her primary? We could wind up with an awful lot of strange names even based on the guild name. How many would know Fainan and Bridhil were the same person?
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Eonwë
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Jul 28, 2004 17:10:32 GMT -5
Post by Eonwë on Jul 28, 2004 17:10:32 GMT -5
Sounds like it might be a good idea. Would alternates then go into the "member" ranking?
I probably won't have more than a couple of main characters anyway, but you never know :}
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Varda
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Jul 31, 2004 17:42:22 GMT -5
Post by Varda on Jul 31, 2004 17:42:22 GMT -5
Alternates would be like regular or Elder members, depending on how active they were, even when my other character is ranked Leader or yours is Heir. But we would know who we really were in MeO and in the guild what honors, even if we are role-playing.
If we can't recognize each other, we're doing something wrong. We'll need to try to keep our character list updated for Elatan to link to on the MeO site.
I think we're getting the hang of it by this MeO text game. Varda's just Fainan, a Silvan archer from Mirkwood, but you know who I really am and that you can trust me. and what I can actually do to help the group.
It's similar to when we're chatting in Diablo and I say something about making star-stuff for role-playing Varda and entertaining the group, but you know it's really just me and go along with the fun, leading the armies of the Valar or whatever. Keep that compass handy, Eonwe!
You also know that when I'm telling this stuff, you and I both know you know already but some poor soul out there may need more confusing, er, explaining.
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Elatan
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Elatan
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Aug 5, 2004 15:18:30 GMT -5
Post by Elatan on Aug 5, 2004 15:18:30 GMT -5
I do not think recruiting will be a problem, it really never has and I hate the idear of trying to convince people to join our ranks and I would rather go the old way. Valar guild picks you if you seem to be a nice fellow. That make us quite an elite-guild, not in gaming but in friendship. We will meet lots and lots of people all of them going for different aspects in the game. some for welth, some for high end items, some for glory... you name it. The few goldnuggets who look for a friendship I have no doubt will find us. As they always have ;D For the ranks I really would like us to keep as close to the old way too. preferable 3 ranks and then 1 leader + 1 heir. I prefer 3 ranks because it keep us close, we have always had a flat structure keeping us as equal as possibel. Ranks has been a neccessity not a pleasure. Placing or using ranks not strictly needed indicates high ranks are "better" or more "wanted" better player, better friend, elite within the guild. The pledge : I doubt there will be many pledges ( guildfriends) in MeO at all unless you can be a pledge in one guild and regular member in another with the same char which I doubt. Why be a guildfriend in Valar if you can be a member in another ? Guildjumping is pretty normal in new games the first 1-2 years until the community has stabilised itself and people found what they are looking for. Guildfriend is something we use on the board to distinctbetween members and none members. In a game it pretty simple, you are a friend if you are no need to point it out really. He will know, we will know. ( Besides; if you have a guildfriend what is all the others then ? obviously NOT friends bad bad signal for a friendly guild who cherish and were founded on the principles of honor, loyalty, and camaraderie as espoused in The Lord of the Rings. ) Hmm my rantings are running loose and I shall but the old ways and basic rules has brought us through 7 years. That justify them as good, solid and working. Exellent foundation, let us just use them. for naming, gaming and all in between. Not my 2 cents, I am probably not finished
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Varda
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Aug 5, 2004 18:54:29 GMT -5
Post by Varda on Aug 5, 2004 18:54:29 GMT -5
So you figure we should continue with leader, heir, Valar, Maiar, and Full Members? That does help put Tolkien and service to the group as a whole above playing, same as we've always done.
No probationary guild-friend for nice players who are in the process of reading the LotR? I guess hearing us in the channel would make spoilers for reading, but maybe we could toss the idea around a bit more.
I meant guild-friend in the sense of elf-friend in the books, not as saying other folk are not friends. Guess it could be misunderstood.
I have an account in EverQuest with one character in a guild and the others not in any guild. If guild-friend is unofficial rather than a MeO rank, like we have it in Diablo, it would not matter if they were in another guild. They could have us in a friend list, probably hear us fine in a party or raid, just not in the main guild chat channel, so the person should be able to function ok. Like to do it that way?
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Elatan
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Elatan
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Post by Elatan on Aug 7, 2004 7:44:29 GMT -5
So you figure we should continue with leader, heir, Valar, Maiar, and Full Members? Yes Varda that is what I prefere, prefer, preffere ?? No probationary guild-friend for nice players who are in the process of reading the LotR? I guess hearing us in the channel would make spoilers for reading, but maybe we could toss the idea around a bit more. I dont see the need for a probationtime. If he have read it and seems ok and take the test he is a member. If he is in a proces of reading and are interested in us he will stick around anyway. If he dont he would probably not stay anyway of other reasons. We have been looking at probationtime before but I think we came to the conclusion a probationtime would not reveal the true nature of a person simply because he is on a probation. Nice players has always been and always will be welcome around us ;D I find it, at this point, hard to place nice players within a future chat/communication system. As it is atm for me in DaoC I place my friends outside guild in friends-list and use PM and chat-groups if we are more than 2. Guess a part of my point is that he may be your friend but not neccerely my friend too. I think talk in guild should only be visible to "full"guildies. If a player is invited to join us on occasion or in general play then, depending on the final communication-system in MeO, setup a chatgroup, battlechat,raidchat or whatever it will be named. I meant guild-friend in the sense of elf-friend in the books, not as saying other folk are not friends. Guess it could be misunderstood. I have an account in EverQuest with one character in a guild and the others not in any guild. If guild-friend is unofficial rather than a MeO rank, like we have it in Diablo, it would not matter if they were in another guild. They could have us in a friend list, probably hear us fine in a party or raid, just not in the main guild chat channel, so the person should be able to function ok. Like to do it that way? Yes that is what I think Varda. In DaoC there is a wide variaty of possible ways to communicate. Basicly they are : Say : all near you can hear it. Yell : all in a wider area than Say can hear it. Friends : All in Friends-list will hear it. ( no matter where they are ) Guild : all in Guild will hear it. ( No matter where they are ) Group : all members in an established group ( max 8 ) can hear it. Chat : All in an established chatgroup can hear it. ( max 150 ) Broad : All in an pre-defined game area ( as a town ) can hear it. ( no limits if their are in area ) Alliance : All members ( with rights given to them by their respective guild) of all guilds within an established alliance can hear it. ( no limits ) Officer : All within the guild with a rank of officer will hear it. Battlechat : All members of a battlegroup can hear it ( max 200 ) Besides these guilds and friends use 3part programs as ventrilo or teamspeak for real life communications. I guess most of the games has something similar and I would be surprized if MeO should not and I am sure it will be possible to keep contact with with others ( friends ) without making a certain rank within the guild for them.
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Eonwë
Vala, Council
Vala and proud member of the Valar Guild. A quarter century of Tolkien fun.
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Aug 17, 2004 22:50:35 GMT -5
Post by Eonwë on Aug 17, 2004 22:50:35 GMT -5
Congratulations Elatan, you managed to convince me of the lack of need in a guild-friend rank :}
I agree in the matter that we should try to keep ranking as close to the original guild structure as possible. I've been doing that with WoW in that I essentially have me (Leader/WoW chair), Valar, Maiar, 2 groups of Members, Guild-friends. The only real differences between the actual guild structure and the one I was looking at was the extra membership tier and the Guild-friend tier. Note that nothing is in stone, as you've convinced me Guild-friend is not really needed :} The extra tier of membership was essentially for rewarding those who have shown commitment to the Valar Guild as a whole as opposed to those just there to play WoW. It would hopefully encourage members to show further commitment, and since as you know it is very difficult getting 3 Valar together for a Maia test, and general Guild sentiment seems to still want this (very much loved by me at least :} ) tradition, it would also give me sort of a standing and recognizable pool of people to consider for Maia. That way there's no loose papers sitting around waiting to be lost :} Plus, if they made it that far, they would likely be at the meeting the test would be dropped on them at :}
Pardon my injecting WoW in here, but I do think this topic affects all of our guild branches, and we should have a general agreement as to what we will and won't, can and can't do as far as ranking.
So if possible, Valar should be Valar in every branch, Maiar Maiar in every branch, where if space is limited, preference is given to those Maiar/Valar actively (regularly) involved in that game. (Example: WC3 branch has limit of 5 officers under the branch leader.) Any Maia or Vala as recognized by the Guild as a whole would of course be able to test for regular members regardless of "rank" in the branch, but they'd have to grab one of the guys who can invite/promote/whatever to get the new guy in. Lucky for me, WoW shouldn't have problems in this area because I can have up to 10 ranks, so I can get Ranks Valar Group1, Valar Group2, etc if it came down to that.
One thing Elatan said I wanted to speak on: ------------------------------ "I do not think recruiting will be a problem, it really never has and I hate the idear of trying to convince people to join our ranks and I would rather go the old way. Valar guild picks you if you seem to be a nice fellow." ------------------------------- I would like to make sure you're not discouraging members from scouting here. Scouting is also a part of the Valar Guild, we just don't accept everyone who comes in, whether scouted or not. The important thing is to remind those who do want to scout that they need to go over the Recruiting page for tips and other important items, and also to remember what is expected of them in our Rules and CoC, as that is also what will be expected of the potential member they bring in. We also need more willing testers so scouts don't overload the ones we currently have. I tend to direct potential guys to meetings if they're able so they can get a taste of what they're in for. If they show up I consider that a good sign. If they don't, no time wasted :}
I'll leave it there, though I have other issues to discuss that aren't related to ranking.
Take care. Eonwë
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Elatan
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Elatan
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Aug 18, 2004 11:56:46 GMT -5
Post by Elatan on Aug 18, 2004 11:56:46 GMT -5
Congratulations Elatan, you managed to convince me of the lack of need in a guild-friend rank :} Nice I must have been in the convincing corner One thing Elatan said I wanted to speak on: ------------------------------ "I do not think recruiting will be a problem, it really never has and I hate the idear of trying to convince people to join our ranks and I would rather go the old way. Valar guild picks you if you seem to be a nice fellow." ------------------------------- I would like to make sure you're not discouraging members from scouting here. Absolutely not Eonwë, I just do not want it to turn into a gift-for-free-guild where we invite each and everyone to join. Not saying we do or have done but we need to keep calm when we are going to be flooded with reguests to join the famous Valar ;D
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Varda
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Aug 18, 2004 12:10:06 GMT -5
Post by Varda on Aug 18, 2004 12:10:06 GMT -5
Don't count on a flood of people trying to join.
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Elatan
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Aug 22, 2004 15:11:31 GMT -5
Post by Elatan on Aug 22, 2004 15:11:31 GMT -5
Why not Varda ?
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